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Discussion Starter #1
lol. I know pretty much nothing about the AR15. iv been doing some research but am still rather lost.

I dont really understand all the differances in the ARs when most all of them look to be the same. =/

Iv been looking at some websites, and i found this AR that that is apealing, only problem is in 5.556x45mm and i want .223 chamber. (DPMS Panther lite 16)

http://dpmsinc.com/firearms/5.56x45mm/lite_16.aspx

It looks exactly how i want my ar to look. 16" barrel, steel sights/carry handel, the tactical stock. I would only be using it for target pratice and maybe squirell hunting, well maybe not, i dont even know the legalitys of that. (I am gonna get a .22LR conversion kit for most of my practice).

I know how I want my AR to look, and that like i said, 16" barrel, open sights/carry handel, .223 chamber, and tactical stock. Very vague, and thta probably sounds dumb for not knowing more about them then that. but could you fill me in on some good info, or suggest another AR to me? just help me find my way here!

lol

And 5.56 and .233 are the same size, but you cant use a .223 in a 5.56 chamber right?

Just help me out here, lol, thanks guys.
 
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Discussion Starter #3
You can use 223 in a 556 chambered barrel not you can't use 566 in a 223 chambered barrel. I would go with the 556 barrel so you can shoot military surplus ammo.
 
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Discussion Starter #4
to clarify, you can shoot .223 in a 5.56, but you shouldn't really shoot 5.56 in a .223. alaskanpopo will tell you different :)confused:), but don't listen to him. a rifle in .223, shooting .223 you handloaded, will be the most accurate, but i don't think the normal shooter would notice a difference. maybe i'm wrong? i think the important things are chrome-lined barrel and chamber, 4140 or 4150 steel barrel, properly staked gas key, and umm...i don't know what else...but i really don't know more than i've learned from talking to people and reading here and arfcom...:rolleyes: :D

eta: too slow...
 
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Discussion Starter #5
PackerfanXD said:
This is where I got mine...Pete at AR15Sales.com will hook you up. He is a huge dealer of AR15s.
+1

I have bought from Pete amny times. Face to face as I am only 30 minutes away. he is a stand up guy. Very fair prices as well.
 
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Discussion Starter #6
lol. I know pretty much nothing about the AR15. iv been doing some research but am still rather lost.

I dont really understand all the differances in the ARs when most all of them look to be the same. =/

Iv been looking at some websites, and i found this AR that that is apealing, only problem is in 5.556x45mm and i want .223 chamber. (DPMS Panther lite 16)
.
Ok as an armorer who is forced to work on DPMS guns don't waste your money. Also don't get a .223 caliber chamber there is no reason for that unless you are building a match rifle. 5.56 chambers are much more versatile and are very accurate with .223 ammo. Its your money but I would stick with a Colt,LMT, BCM, or a Sabre Defense product.
Here is the Tier listing for AR's. Stay away from Tier 3 if you can help it.

Tier 1- Those companies that manufacture in strict accordance with the TDP and have been purchased & utilized by the US Military.

Tier 2- Those companies that follow the TDP closely (with some minor deviation) and may sell components and replacement parts to the US Military.

Tier 3- Everyone else.


Tier One: manufacturers with US government contracts for their rifles...

Colt
LMT
FNH

Tier Two: manufacturers who do not have a US government contract for their files, but are in strict accordance with the TDP nonetheless...

Sabre Defence
BCM

Tier Three: QC varies but the common denominator is that they generally don't follow the TDP 100%; essentially, everyone else...

CMMG
RRA
Armalite
Bushmaster
DPMS, etc...
 
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Discussion Starter #7
amishclark said:
to clarify, you can shoot .223 in a 5.56, but you shouldn't really shoot 5.56 in a .223. alaskanpopo will tell you different :)confused:), but don't listen to him. a rifle in .223, shooting .223 you handloaded, will be the most accurate, but i don't think the normal shooter would notice a difference. maybe i'm wrong? i think the important things are chrome-lined barrel and chamber, 4140 or 4150 steel barrel, properly staked gas key, and umm...i don't know what else...but i really don't know more than i've learned from talking to people and reading here and arfcom...:rolleyes: :D

eta: too slow...
Excuse me. Don't misquote me. I never said it was ok to shoot 5.56 ammo in a .223 chamber.

Also I would advise people not to listen to posters who sole information comes from other posters on the internet. Yes that means YOU.

Pat
 
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Discussion Starter #8
Alaskapopo said:
Ok as an armorer who is forced to work on DPMS guns don't waste your money. Also don't get a .223 caliber chamber there is no reason for that unless you are building a match rifle. 5.56 chambers are much more versatile and are very accurate with .223 ammo. Its your money but I would stick with a Colt,LMT, BCM, or a Sabre Defense product.
Here is the Tier listing for AR's. Stay away from Tier 3 if you can help it.

Tier 1- Those companies that manufacture in strict accordance with the TDP and have been purchased & utilized by the US Military.

Tier 2- Those companies that follow the TDP closely (with some minor deviation) and may sell components and replacement parts to the US Military.

Tier 3- Everyone else.

Tier One: manufacturers with US government contracts for their rifles...

Colt
LMT
FNH

Tier Two: manufacturers who do not have a US government contract for their files, but are in strict accordance with the TDP nonetheless...

Sabre Defence
BCM

Tier Three: QC varies but the common denominator is that they generally don't follow the TDP 100%; essentially, everyone else...

CMMG
RRA
Armalite
Bushmaster
DPMS, etc...
OH noes, here we go with the tiered BS all over again. :rolleyes:
 
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Discussion Starter #9
some people posted in my thread maybe their post will help you my topic is called AR-15 3 pages of helpful info.
 
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Discussion Starter #10
Thanks that info did help me out some. But theres just no way i could afford a colt. idk about the prices on the others but im assuming they are comparable.

I really want an AR15 for no more then $800... (then geting the .22LR conversion after that)

Blazer, ill give your thread a a good read. i think i read it, but ill go back and read it again.
 
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Discussion Starter #11
Odin said:
OH noes, here we go with the tiered BS all over again. :rolleyes:
I actually think its interesting. Good info to have. I have a LCW lower..which is made by LMT woohoo! Of course my upper is T3
 
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Discussion Starter #13
Alaskapopo said:
Also I would advise people not to listen to posters who sole information comes from other posters on the internet. Yes that means YOU.

Pat
yes. do not listen to me. none of what i said is good advice. only buy tier one, as they are the only ones that go "bang." :rolleyes:

sorry, pat for misquoting you. i went back and read the post i was refering(sp?) to. you said that .223 and 5.56 are essentially the same, only 5.56 is hotter (i thought this was technically incorrect, but whatever...); the main difference being that "5.56 has a smaller case volume because of thicker brass" (paraphrased, of course...). you did however, go on to clarify that shooting 5.56 in .223 was not safe, so me aculpa, i guess?
 
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Discussion Starter #14
Alaskapopo said:
Its not BS. But you have a right to your own opinion even if its wrong.
Pat:cool:
And who made up this "tiered" set up? Internet Commandos..... Being mil spec doesn't mean **** to me. Goverment contracts are not always given to the best company. How many stories have we heard of M16s failing in the field?

I would put my piece meal tiered 30 AR against any Colt any day of the week. At least mine won't rust under the FSB. :cool:
 
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Discussion Starter #15
Odin said:
And who made up this "tiered" set up? Internet Commandos...... :cool:
Well if you consider Pat Rodgers one of the best rifle instructors going an Internet commando then yes. Also the Military does have the strictect requirments on its guns. Mil Spec means something. I have been to plenty of rifle classes and the gones that keep working are usually Colts or LMT's. The ones with broken bolts and other issues are Bushmasters, DPMS, ect.

Also I would rather have rust under the front sight base than a broken bolt any day.
Pat
 
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Discussion Starter #16
The armouror for Scottsdale Gun Club (the largest indoor range in the country) says he recommends RRA over every other brand- and they don't even sell RRA there...take it for what its worth.
 
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Discussion Starter #17
PackerfanXD said:
he recommends RRA over every other brand- and they don't even sell RRA there...take it for what its worth.
not tier one! don't buy it!!!

lol

p.s. since rra supplies the dea with rifles, why do they not fall in to tier 1? if their products are shody compared to tier 1, why does the dea buy them? also, when did lmt get a contract? i did not know about that...but how could i, being an uninformed internet user?
 
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Discussion Starter #18
amishclark said:
not tier one! don't buy it!!!

lol

p.s. since rra supplies the dea with rifles, why do they not fall in to tier 1? if their products are shody compared to tier 1, why does the dea buy them? also, when did lmt get a contract? i did not know about that...but how could i, being an uninformed internet user?
Yes RRA was one of the companies to win the DEA (not dea) contract. That does not mean they are mil spec. Nor does it mean they have the quality control Colt has such as MP testing all bolts and barrels. Correct M4 feed ramps, Correct steel in the barrel. ect.

As for the RRA armorer. Wow he works in a gun rental range. Thats about like getting advice from a gun store clerk.

Anyway this thread has the potential to get nasty. When you have a habit of misquoting people and then failing to appoligize when called on it.
Lets keep the sarcasim and other petty crap out of this thread.
Pat
 
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Discussion Starter #19
Tier or no tier, one just has to buy according to what he can afford.

If OP has $800 to spend, then I would say the best bang for the money would be RRA or Bushy, compared to Oly or DPMS. Well, ok, I am letting my bias shown!:mrgreen:
 
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Discussion Starter #20
My Stag M4 runs every bit as good as a "Tier 1".

Other than the fact that Colt, FN, and LMT are .mil suppliers, the rest of your opinion is just that, OPINION. And I take it with a grain of salt, and go about my day.

No Kool-Aid in this house.
 
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